Right. Kevin: That's right. Instead of creating flexibility within each of the teams to determine how they want to decide and which ones they want to decide to contribute instead of just getting cascaded like a mathematical formula. And that's how we grew really fast. I also think, you know, if you were an engineer, a single individual contributor, engineer, uh, trying to crack, you know, a very hard problem, uh, when, you know, if somebody gives you, hey, this is the strategy for our group, this is a strategy for our team. Google. Series F funding from Google, Tencent, JD.com and Mitsubishi. Nadiem: Yeah, I get it. The Wisdom List: Kevin Aluwi. Move CTO S. Move Business Intelligence I. Right. And the third theme is really about building bridges and breaking walls. They just had a way or a means to communicate through bottom up. Oh, I love this feature. This ownership gives everyone responsibility to put their best and gives meaning to daily work. We actually forced groups to share their key results. Test. And then I left after a while, right? Right? Yeah. And I'm always really amazed at you know companies that will say like, okay, this is one thing we're really going to nail. You, you left. Hmm. If you just set from top down that, that direction without actually taking in the feedback and inputs of each of those key leads under you, I think that's where the beginning of the end, you know, like that's where you start losing credibility, you start losing trust and you start losing motivation. Ranked #11 on Fortunes top 50 companies that changed the world. Or like hit a reliability rate of X percent. Many companies seek to create cultures that are productive and foster a positive work environment. Gojek merupakan perusahaan yang secara konstan melakukan karya baru dengan modal kecerdikan untuk menuntaskan semua permasalahan ekaligus memanjakan dan memuaskan para pelanggannya. . Gojek and Tokopedia unite to form GoTo, the largest tech group in Indonesia and the go to ecosystem for daily life. Bertahun-tahun mereka mengedepankan lingkungan bekerja yang seru . They break it down into the core values to help the employees reflects on the behaviour. It was like, okay, that sounds cool. Enter the Gojek app. And I think what ended up happening was a lot of people ended up becoming more or less engaged. I think just forcing, just saying that, hey, collaborate more without it being bottom up I think probably makes top down worse, right? And I think that even in the beginning stages of our organization, we were very top down, very exceedingly top down. I haven't gone home since like two days. And that was the payoff in my mind. And the what you know, is easy to validated are those, you know, those numbers, uh, those, uh, those media stories are easy to kind of, um, it's easy to see that, oh, that's kind of the, uh, the, the objective. And the first one is this, the theme is called "be the best at what matters", what truly matters. To the point of what's sustainable. It's people, usually people or media, uh, usually highlight the things that, um, short term strategies often are closely linked to. I think that's dangerous, right? Yeah. Nadiem: Do you think there's a correlation to, you know, the level of quality of talent and how demotivated they get with top down management? Researchers - Global UXAlliance, Usaria, and Somia CX. And, and because you also understand the decision making that goes into, into that, um, you are also much better at problem solving, right? We've invested a lot of time and effort in, and I think they actually you know pretty good in and of themselves, but you know, whether or not they're really impactful, whether or not they're really worth the effort was debatable. You can, you can either be a people leader, but you can also be a thought leader. Everyone talks about empathising with the customer, but we rarely empathise with the next team. I think there's also oftentimes that question from, from a lot of folks who then, you know, or might be resistant towards this idea, it inherently kind of challenges, um, maybe, you know, traditional notions of what somebody in a leadership position should be doing. Thought leadership means actually thinking on your own two feet and being able to come up with solutions that are better than whatever your boss tells you. Right. 2. Ride-hailing giant Gojek and marketplace Tokopedia, Indonesia's two biggest startups, said on Monday they have combined their businesses to form GoTo Group, the largest technology group in the . So make those painful moves early. Right? But you know with all great things, I think we've come to two kind of conclusions. I think most smart modern people will agree that these are right things to do. I don't know. The content in this post has been approved by Gojek.. Pamela Chan Sep 23, 2022 4 min read Culture From the East to West and back: Meet Giri Kuncoro Investment Stage Late Stage Venture. Right? For me it's when they're trying to raise something to me, right? And it's hard. Culture matters because it boosts productivity, agility, employee engagement, and innovation. Read writing about Culture in Life at Gojek. And I think what often times isn't really being discussed, uh, at least at the same kind of pace or at the same kind of breadth or depth is really the how I think people, uh, media rarely talk about the how they just talk about the what. Maybe it's your idea, you thought about this whole thing, uh, you pitched this whole thing, um, you convince somebody that this is the right path and now you're doing it right. And I think the good sign of a bottom up leader is one that is secure in knowing that their job is to provide the platform and distill from their team, you know, the best ideas. Kevin: I think for me, I agree with everything that you said. The level of interdependency is so high is that you have to be a creative problem solver in order to be an effective leader. Um, that process not involving your one downs in that process is basically the first, it's like the original sin. Kevin: Yeah. We do our utmost to get this right. PAPER GOJEK.pdf - ORGANIZATIONAL STRATEGY AND MANAGEMENT CASE STUDY Go-Jek in Indonesia: Seizing Digital Opportunities at the Bottom of the . Because they're closer to the problems. Nadiem: I just got it done. Kevin: Yeah, I think so. Um, and it's out of our control, right? That's a short term. Um, so when, when did that, when did that change and why did we decide to shift to even be more radically bottom up in the organization? I was just labeled a dreamer all the time. Nadiem: Like they want to be the best at recommendations. Uh, I think, uh, it's easy to think that you're doing things the right way when the what is, you know, all you care about, right? You don't have a top down a way of working. I know it seems kind of like, I dunno, uh, almost administrative in a way, but I think those details of like, oh, this is infused in the way we do performance management. Right? Yeah, very, very powerful stuff happens so you have to back it up. To make matters worse, Sam was just getting off a plane in Singapore. How would you approach like, your kind of parenting style with respect to this, right. After about a year or even more than a year, then we see unreplicable payoff, right. Spreads wings across Vietnam and Thailand. And how did you feel? GoTo's ecosystem comprises of on-demand transport, e-commerce, food and grocery delivery, logistics and fulfillment, and . [3] [4] Saat ini, Gojek telah tersedia di 50 kota di Indonesia. Okay. Right. Like what should they do and, and what would you give them credit for? Massive moats. It's about being the best at what truly matters, which is about a focus. Yeah. Nadiem: That's right. Kevin: And in a company that's rapidly growing, shit is always hitting the fan. thegeneralist.substack.com. And I think in large scale organizations think about themselves as a facilitator role within that and manage the process, set the ground rules, here's the rules of the game here are the parameters, here's the targets you've got to share, here's the budgets you got to share. But in the bigger scheme of things, it's not what truly matters to their end user. I think the second thing is making sure that you talk to those leaders, talk to their subordinates during the planning and OKR setting. Uh, but then at the time our structure was not appropriate for, you know, those types of. Building a strong organizational culture is a long journey, one that requires exceptional focus and consistency between the various layers (from beliefs to rituals, from heroes to symbols . First, is actually coming up with problems instead of solutions. People's incentive is to, oh, okay, my boss told me to do that. Right. Yes. It's so complicated. Kevin: And so you see like the, that payoff, right? . So a lot of companies and organizations try to tell their teams you must collaborate more, but they don't create the goal setting incentive with which to achieve that. For a product designer, Gojek is a great place to be. Because you understand the whole logic of like, why you made these decisions. Kevin: But did you also know people who are totally fine with just like, hey, heads down. GoFood becomes the world's most helpful and user-friendly app during the pandemic. And so let's talk about these three things. Yeah. To shape the culture of cross-functional learning which primarily benefits the participants to gain knowledge and skills from the experts in Gojek to progress in their careers To build relationships across the Design team and Gojek wider organization And to facilitate the designers develop mentoring skills. It's hard and, it's hard in any kind of fast paced industry, right? Uh, but then it just didn't, it, it didn't matter. Like what, what does this mean? Nadiem: Fear and money. Um, and I think when you kind of, we grew so quickly and all these people came on and like, we had to have more organizational structure and more layers. The other is fear. Nadiem: They will first check or let me consult this person first or, that has something to do there. I think coming in year three, four, five and then 10 years is exponentially greater. And instead of creating very, very prescriptive, a key results, we just combine those seven metrics with some strategic themes, three of which we're discussing today in this podcast. Speed (kecepatan), dalam melakukan segala sesuatu gojek mengerjakannnya dengan cepat. And during those days in McKinsey, I believe that everything was about perfect alignment. Number of Exits 3. And I think in a world where, you know, a company is growing and in a world where there is competitive pressure obviously in many different, you know, from many different angles in the business, I think there is the temptation to say, oh, we have to win every single thing. Nadiem: but that's the difference, right? Primary Focus: Mentorship and teamwork. Right. Questioning authority was not, you know, something that was viewed positively and, but then how did you feel in terms of, you know, the things that you did, uh, with respect to that authority? Like if imagine trying to start another just general video sharing platforms. Yeah, exactly. Kevin: Yeah. Gojek is founded on the principle of using technology to remove life's daily frictions by connecting consumers to the best providers of goods and services in the market. And we're also much further from the problem. So what I've realized is that the best bottom up leaders will never do that. And, and as leadership, we had no idea that this is such a big problem. Like nothing is ever on fire and then you, oh, you have to do these things now. At GO-JEK, to overcome this, we encourage regular, short term movements from one team to another. It's gonna be what where we are going to do or be our best at. So if you're, if you, if you don't have that mental resilience to know that your baby could be irrelevant, yeah. At the very best. Yeah. And you instantly saw the energy in the room whereby it wasn't just leader saying, oh, I like that. If you just focus on output numbers, then at a certain point, those output numbers like revenues, sustainability, all of this other stuff might go down over time if you're not investing in the long term leading indicators of health in an organization. In all companies. There are very, very many good benevolent dictators in tech companies out there, right? And you saw that even in our, in our core product group, a session where everyone was like typing questions and challenges online. Uh, you know, people. For us at GO-JEK, culture is a collective philosophy about how to build products that change lives. And the research and the data is very important as well. For us at GO-JEK, culture is a collective philosophy about how to build products that change lives. Nadiem: And so the, the role of leadership there, and I think that there's a point to be made about when you're talking about building bridges and breaking walls, forcing that from a top down approach also is not very effective. Our founding team members are all Internet and e-commerce veterans, with extensive experience from well-known Chinese, SEA & US tech companies such as Alibaba, Google, Facebook, Gojek, Lazada, etc. Kevin: Right. It's a very small, it's very small nuance, but yet critical. You can't just, you can't just throw it out there. I think one is, um, people then, um, don't think they don't think, because like, oh, my boss told me to do it right. Hmm. I think, um, there's almost a cost to it actually. So keeping it real is kind of our mantra. Nadiem: And why is that a bad thing? Yeah. Right. Nadiem: A lot of people confuse that. Move Accounting W. Move Sales A. Gojek, a local company that has been operating since 2011, has an average of 200 new drivers per month. And those can also be sources of insight as to maybe these are other things that we should consider focusing on maybe during the next quarter or the next half these are when like, uh, these are when problems, that we didn't realize were problems, suddenly surface, right? Right. So this theme is about focus. Right. GOJEK does ride hailing, food delivery, payments even on demand massages. So I think on the planning process, what's your idea of an ideal bottom up leader? The CEO of Gojek shares his lessons of creating a principled culture, managing organizational debt, and building true moats. Right? And getting feedback from people about that. And here's where it gets really tricky. Understanding and interpreting organizational culture is important, as it affects organizational development, productivity, and learning at all levels. And what's really interesting about it is that all these hows have no short term payoffs. I think that one especially, you know, coming from anyone, you know, listening who is coming from a leadership, I think it's very, very easy, um, without malice to kind of, um, think that, you know, top down either explicitly or implicitly is better. I think, I think one very easy one. And this is infused in how we run meetings and cadences. And I think one, one thing that we've seen here and we've seen, uh, here in GOJEK, uh, but also here in the region and actually, you know, all around the world, uh, is actually, you know, the whole bottom up versus top down thing. You understand the key results that you were trying to achieve. Nadiem: Well did I think, I think we've covered a lot of ground here. Today, we're gonna talk a little bit about some things that matter very much personally to us in terms of the philosophy of building a long term sustainable successful business. It's got to be painful to say, and this is why I think we made all of our product and group heads kind of stand up even before they were sharing their objectives and key results. Gojek is an app that providing a variety of services from payments, food delivery, transportation, and logistics. Especially because, you know when the, then the company is like 30 people all in the same room, even top down doesn't feel very top down, right? We grew 900x in 18 months and still rapidly doubling. Because it's easy to say, oh, those things don't matter and it's easy. And kind of see that in you check in like every year it's still the thing that they really want to nail that level of conviction of saying like, oh, we're going to be great at this. Or you have to constantly experiment by default, that means you have to fail most of the time. Nadiem: Yeah. Like usually the, what I've realized is that the more talented a person is their level of disillusionment when they hit that kind of top down mindset without actually being able to air or voice their opinion effectively enough and guide the direction of whatever scope they're doing is even more cataclysmic for great talent. Yup. . Pay Off. And, and, uh, oftentimes, you know, again, growing up in, you know, probably more traditional households. And I think it's much easier for companies to ignore this fact, but if you get that right in the beginning, there's your probability of success. You're helping with this, you're responsible for that. If you just kind of have to really view things from you know, a problem or customer or user first. And the other is a probably not doing a great job and I'm probably disappointing people, I'm probably dropping balls. Right. I think in many ways we have to sacrifice the concept of overly, number one, overly rewarding teams for their achievements of their own team only instead of the bigger group or the bigger company for that reason. Should we go one by one and talk about it? Go-Jek has a board of directors and a board of commissioners, in accordance with the dual governance structure that's mandated by Indonesian law. It's all fun and Games until you get that decision wrong. Long term success takes a lot of sacrifice in the short term. Type 1: Clan Culture. I look at all these great things that this thing can do now, but, right. And then suddenly like a product just like leaps in terms of just quality, uh, you know, about like a year or two years after that. So it's funny, it's almost the same thing. That's exactly the, the, you know, the concept of not being able to have agency or control over your thing when you know that you are capable, that's a difference. 1. GoFood rated #1 user-friendly app during the pandemic. We like to talk about things we like and talk about things we don't like. INTROUCTION Organizational culture means a common perception held by the organization's members. Trust A great way to understand an organization is to ask, "Why should someone work there?" For me, it's the people. Like instead of going up, Oh Kevin, you've got this major issue with allocation in this one city, I need you to immediately pump up incentives right now by this percent so that we can hit a BCR of this percent. Nadiem: With the context of being a bottom up facilitating leader, right? Jan 13, 2022. Over 20 products, 2 million driver partners. Yeah. Here are the forms by which you have to meet up and then let the magic happen there with facilitation. Description of Gojek. And I think in a way I think we're almost, we have a bias towards finding smart, creative, driven people. Move Marketing A. Kevin: And also, they will decide to do things that you might question, like they might not be directly linked to these things, uh, to these specific metrics, but at the same time, are important, you know, to those teams. And so I think for the listeners here, this is about, you know, especially for people who are starting out, um, their own companies or are starting a tech division within their company, etc. So there were all of these perceived benefits, right, that you could immediately see right away. And then it's like a cascading process. That should be like a fundamental kind of mechanism that happens. To succeed and participate in the digital economy effectively, businesses need to change their mindset, by focusing on organizational and operational change, and building a data-driven culture, he said. Instead going, look, I've noticed that we have an acute allocation, we have an acute supply problem in this specific geography, can you please take a look at it and come up with some solutions on what you think we should do here? Well, it's hard. Twitter. I mean on a daily basis shit is hitting the fan. Everyone, you know, media is writing about, look at all this amazing stuff. Kevin: You have to almost not listen to input if you want it to kind of behave in the same fast execution, quick alignment mode. Nadiem: Yeah. But I really think that, you know, YouTube have such a large advantage, I think in the general video space I really don't see how they could get challenged in the near term. Do you understand what the objective was? Gojek becomes Indonesias first unicorn. Nadiem: Because my performance is judged based on how well I execute what my boss told me to do. We currently operate HQ offices in both Jakarta and Hangzhou, China. Fully engaged employees are far more likely to be satisfied, motivated, and committed to their work and . Right? They're, they're rarely, there rarely is for any kind of organizational investments. Strong Communication and teamwork trans-sectored is wanted in the Corporate Culture at Google. Through a divisional approach, the departments are grouped by-products. How well and how quickly can I do it? 1. Review the different organizational structures most commonly used. Um, because you Nadiem: it's so fuzzy sometimes. We just did. Nadiem: like it creates these moats. A great way to understand an organization is to ask, Why should someone work there?. And obviously, you know. And then, it is a tenuous balance and I think in some ways, right? Oh. And that is actually you run into huge amounts of problems, cascading targets that way. 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